Did the flood really happen?

 

This section is still under construction.  The following are sections obtained from the internet that spell out a few basic arguments.


2348 BCE

4350 years ago



There are basically two schools of thought with regard to the flood:  Creation Scientists and Evolutionary Scientists.


Creationists believe that earth history is just as it is spelled out in the Bible.  They typically believe in a literal world wide flood and look for evidence to support that idea in the



Lack of Evidence for a Global Flood Where we Would Expect it.

A global flood would have produce evidence contrary to the evidence we see.


Why is there no evidence of a flood in ice core series? Ice cores from Greenland have been dated back more than 40,000 years by counting annual layers. Why doesn't evidence for the flood show up?


Why did the Flood not leave traces on the sea floors? A year long flood should be recognizable in sea bottom cores. Why do none of these show up?


Why is there no evidence of a flood in tree ring dating? Tree ring records go back more than 10,000 years, with no evidence of a catastrophe during that time.


How are the polar ice caps even possible? Such a mass of water as the Flood would have provided sufficient buoyancy to float the polar caps off their beds and break them up. They wouldn't regrow quickly.


Evidence supports the uninterrupted human occupation of the Americas (over 12,000 years) and Australasia (about 30,000-40,000 years) from long before the time that the flood could have happened.



Evidence that Fossil-Bearing Rock Strata Were Not Laid Down in a Single Event

Most people who believe in a global flood also believe that the flood was responsible for creating all fossil-bearing strata. However, there is a great deal of contrary evidence.


How was the fossil record sorted in an order convenient for evolution if they were laid down in the turmoil of a single flood?


How do surface features appear far from the surface? Deep in the geologic column there are formations which could have originated only on the surface, such as: Rain drops, river channels, wind-blown dunes, beaches, in-place trees, soil and footprints.


How could a flood deposit layered fossil forests? Stratigraphic sections showing a dozen or more mature forests layered atop each other (all with upright trunks, in-place roots, and well-developed soil) appear in many locations. How could these have appeared in the midst of a catastrophic flood? They are evidence of a slow deposition in environmentally sensitive conditions incompatible with a catastrophic deluge.


How were mountains and valleys formed? Many very tall mountains are composed of sedimentary rocks. If these were formed during the Flood, how did they reach their present height, and when were the valleys between them eroded away? Keep in mind that many valleys were clearly carved by glacial erosion, which is a slow process.


Also of no importance is that these flood stories appear to be cribbed from the neighboring Bablylonians. Even though the scientific evidence strongly indicates that the Babylonian texts are older than the Jewish texts, Bible believers know that can't be so. Therefore, the scientists are wrong. The Bible story is older. End of story.

Comparing the stories

The Chaldean Flood Tablets from the city of Ur in what is now Southern Iraq, describe how the Bablylonian God Ea had decided to eliminate humans and other land animals with a great flood which was to become "the end of all flesh". He selected Ut-Napishtim, to build an ark to save a few humans, and samples of other animals.

The Babylonian text "The Epic of Galgamesh" 1,8 and the Hebrew story are essentially identical with about 20 major points in common. Their texts are obviously linked in some way. Either Genesis was copied from an earlier Babylonian story, or the Galgamesh myth was copied from an earlier Hebrew story, or both were copied from a common source that predates them both.

The Genesis and Galgamesh stories have many similarities:

The Genesis story describes how mankind had become obnoxious to God; they were hopelessly sinful and wicked. In the Babylonian story, they were too numerous and noisy.


The Gods (or God)  decided to send a worldwide flood. This would drown men, women, children, babies and infants, as well as eliminate all of the land animals and birds. 


The Gods (or God) knew of one righteous man, Ut-Napishtim or Noah.


The Gods (or God) ordered the hero to build a multi-story wooden ark (called a chest or box in the original Hebrew).


The ark would be sealed with pitch. 


The ark would have with many internal compartments


It would have a single door 


It would have at least one window.


The ark was built and loaded with the hero, a few other humans, and samples from all species of other land animals. 


A great rain covered the land with water.


The mountains were initially covered with water. 


The ark landed on a mountain in the Middle East. 


The hero sent out birds at regular intervals to find if any dry land was in the vicinity. 


The first two birds returned to the ark. The third bird apparently found dry land because it did not return.


The hero and his family left the ark, ritually killed an animal, offered it as a sacrifice.


God (or the Gods in the Epic of Gilgamesh) smelled the roasted meat of the sacrifice.


The hero was blessed. 


The Babylonian gods seemed genuinely sorry for the genocide that they had created. The God of Noah appears to have regretted his actions as well, because he promised never to do it again.


Center for scientific creation Walter Brown

Hydroplate theory is interesting but does not prove that god did it.



The were a number of differences between the two stories:

Noah received his instructions directly from Jehovah; Ut-Napishtim received them indirectly during a dream.


Noah's ark was 3 stories high and rectangular in shape. Two estimated dimensions are 547 x 91 ft. and 450 x 75 ft. The Babylonian ark was 6 stories high and square.


Ut-Napishtim invited additional people on board: a pilot and some skilled workmen.


Noah's ark landed on Mt. Ararat; Ut-Napishtim'sat on Mt. Nisir; these locations are both in the Middle East, and are located few hundred miles apart 


In the Bible, some of the water emerged from beneath the earth. And the rains from above lasted for 40 days and nights. A 40 day interval often symbolized a period of judgment in the Hebrew Scriptures. 2 In the Babylonian account, the water came only in the form of rain, and lasted only 6 days. 


Noah released a raven once and a dove twice; Ut-Napishtim released three birds: a dove, swallow and raven.


Scientific Evidence for a Worldwide Flood
Part Four of a Five-Part Series on The Age of the Earth.

 

Two Vastly Different World Views, with Vastly Different Conclusions:
Let's not kid ourselves.  What this is all about is whether or not the Old Testament book of Genesis (along with the rest of the Old Testament, and the New Testament) is an accurate account of what happened around 4600 years ago with regard to a worldwide flood, and about 6000 years ago, with regard to Creation itself.

Was virtually all of the sedimentary strata laid down by a single Worldwide Deluge in a short amount of time, or is the evolutionary scenario of slow change, acting over eons of T-I-M-E, and the associated Geological Time Chart (with its millions and millions of years) a more accurate account of Earth history?

It's also about God's future judgment of mankind.  That's because Jesus Christ, Himself, related the Great Flood of Noah's day to His own return to earth to reign over it and the people in it.  See Luke 17:20-27, 19:11-27; John 5:22-23, 12:32, and Rev. 20:4-15.

Let's Look at the Evidence:
The following are 18 Evidences of either massive flooding and erosion, extremely rapid layering of strata, or direct evidence of a Worldwide Flood.  Such evidences are found in numerous places on virtually every Continent.  

Polystrate Fossils: 
One of the strongest pieces of evidence for a worldwide flood is the existence of what Rupke termed "polystrate fossils."  Such fossils are found all over the world.  They usually consist of fossil  trees that were buried upright, and which often traverse multiple  layers of strata such as sandstone, limestone, shale, and even coal beds. 1,2,3,4  They range in size from small rootlets to trees over 80 feet long. 3   Sometimes they are oblique in relation to the surrounding strata, but more often they are perpendicular to it.  For example, at Joggins, Nova Scotia, polystrate  tree (and root) fossils are found at various intervals throughout roughly 2,500 feet of strata. Many of these are from 10-20 feet  long,  5,6 and, at least  one was 40 feet long. 5,6,7  

Very few of these upright fossil trees have attached roots, and only about 1 in 50 8  have both roots and rootlets attached.  Such trees, and their -- more often than not -- missing roots, are discussed in much more detail in  The "Fossil Forests" of Nova Scotia. 9  Likewise, many (if not most) of the large, fragmented, and  broken-off  Stigmaria roots are also missing their rootlets.

Many of these roots and rootlets, are also buried individually. 9  This strongly  suggests that these trees did not grow in the same places where they were buried, but rather were  uprooted and re-deposited there.  

Similar circumstances occur at various other places in Nova Scotia, as well as in the United States, England, Germany, and France.  Another place where large tree stumps are preserved without their roots attached is  Axel Heiberg 10,11 Island in Northern Canada.

And although there is much data on buried trees in the geological literature, most of it is over 100 years old, and difficult to access.  One of the few articles on this subject was by Rupke, and in it he comments that:

“Personally, I am of the opinion that the polystrate fossils  constitute a crucial phenomenon  both to the actuality and the mechanism of cataclysmic deposition.  Curiously  a  paper on  polystrate fossils appears to be a  'black swan’  in geological literature.  Antecedent to this synopsis a systematic discussion of  the relevant  phenomena was never published.  However, geologists must have been informed about these fossils.  In view of this it seems unintelligible that uniformitarianism has kept its dominant position." 12

With regard to Rupke's observation, I suspect the reason why such is (still) the case has more to do with one's personal bias against the concept of a Creator / God to whom we might very well have to give account than to the ever-mounting evidence against the theory of evolution and the millions of years old Earth that it requires (to appear plausible).  However, T-I-M-E is simply not enough: not even BILLIONS of years of it.

See also The Organic Levels of the Yellowstone Petrified Forest 13 and  The Yellowstone Petrified "Forests"  14 by Harold Coffin.

The Fossils Themselves:
Fossils don't form on lake bottoms today,  nor are they found  forming on the bottom of the sea.
15  Instead, they normally only form when a plant or animal is buried soon after it  dies. 16  Therefore, the fossils themselves are evidence of a catastrophe such as a  flood or volcanic eruption that took place in the past.  See also Rapid Petrification of Wood, by Andrew Snelling.

Clastic Dikes:  According to  Austin, a clastic dike is "a cross cutting body of sedimentary material which has been intruded into a foreign rock mass."  17

"These dikes...(may) penetrate horizontal sedimentary strata (or) they may occur... in  igneous and  metamorphic rocks.  The process of  formation of a clastic dike is analogous to wet sand oozing up between ones toes, but on a much larger scale." 17

Clastic dikes present a problem to the "mythions of years" mindset of evolution in  that  massive "older" sediments are found intruding up into overlying younger strata.  This  must have occurred while the "older" sediments were still in a plastic state. 

What took these "older" sediments so long to become hard?

One would  think that a million  years would be more than enough  time to turn massive sand laden sediments into sandstone,  yet we have an example of sediments which  are said to be  80 million years older than those above them, and yet they still had not become hard, but were in  a wet and plastic state when an earth movement  caused them to be forced  up into the (supposedly  much) "younger" sediments.  Such things not only present serious problems for the evolutionary  method of  "dating", but also tell us that something is wrong with the millions of years mindset of evolutionary theory itself, and thus cause strongly suspicion that we are not being told the truth by the mass media, nor the "Scientific" community of believers in evolution. 17,18,19 

Mt. St. Helens:
Three separate eruptions produced  sedimentary-type layers hundreds of feet thick. 
One of these was a hurricane velocity deposit that produced thousands of thin  laminations up to 25 feet thick  10,11,12  The third eruption was a  lava flow,  which  turned into a hot mud-flow as it  crossed the Toutle River.  This hot mud flow not only diverted  the  river, but carved a 17 mile long  series of canyons (up to 140 feet deep) in a matter of hours.  They call it the Little Grand Canyon of  the Toutle River." 20,21,22   And to this very day, the neither the mass media, nor any  popular  "science" publications have told the public what happened. 23  For more on this see  Mt. St. Helens: Evidence in Support of Biblical Catastrophe.

Palouse Canyon:  
In Eastern Washington State there is a canyon that was eroded  through solid  basalt by Lake Missoula floods in 1-2 days. This canyon is  300 to 500 feet deep.  See references below for more information. 24,25,26,27,28 

Observations at an Australian Beach:  
At Greenmount  Beach on the Gold Coast of Queensland, an interesting thing occurred: "clear laminations, or layering, in the sand--formed  by  the separation of  normal silica-sand grains and smaller, denser mineral sand-grains such as rutile which are dark  in color.. The  layering was present along the whole sand mass exposed." 29   Emphasis Added

"This was produced as a result of a beach restoration project (which involved) the dredging of  sand  from  (a) sand bar (on) the Tweed River and  carrying it  by ship several kilometres north to the southern  Gold Coast beaches, where it was pumped ashore as a water/sand slurry through a large pipe to the beach."  29  See also Talking About Geology / Varves. 30  Emphasis Added

Spontaneous Sorting of Layers:
Laboratory experiments have shown  that spontaneous sorting and layering occurs with a sand, mud and clay slurry. 
When the mixture slows down, the sand, mud  and clay will  spontaneously precipitate (settle out) and form individual layers.   Dr. Guy Berthault  has performed a number of experiments which demonstrate this. 31,32,33  Those who wish to see for themselves,  may do so by simply ordering one of the following videos :  Evolution: Fact or Belief?  Or  Experiments in Stratification. 

Turbidity Currents:
A turbidity current is  an  underwater  mud flow, the discovery  of  which caused somewhat of a revolution in  geology.  As  a  result, many sedimentary  strata layers throughout  the world have been reevaluated and found to be turbidites. 34,35,36,37,38,39,40

For example, regarding turbidites and the impact they are having on modern Geology, Kurt Howard, 41 said the following in his paper on this topic: 

My physical geology professor said, "Regarding uniformitarianism, you can take it  with a grain of salt."  After reviewing geology texts on the subject of turbidites, I am following the courageous professor's advice. To  paraphrase his words, I am taking uniformitarianism with a grain of sand, for the philosophy of uniformitarianism states that sedimentary layers form over many millions of years, while ... recent research has shown that turbidites form within a few hours. {1}  Emphasis Added

In  1972 Burgert  identified several lower basal Tapeats units as turbidites in Grand Canyon's Cheops Bay. Dr. Ariel Roth a geologist at Loma Linda University's Geoscience Institute, suggested that 30% of all sedimentary rocks in Grand Canyon are turbidites. Some geologists suggest that 50% of the world's sedimentary rocks might be turbidites. Emphasis Added

Modern geologists discarded the terms flysch sediments and geosyncline because rapidly formed megathick flysch is incompatible with uniformitarianism and long ages. However, in the last few years, the number of geologists abandoning the classical uniformitarian discipline  and adopting the new catastrophism is almost a shock to ... creationists. Geologists are finally beginning to grudgingly agree with ... creationists about the nature of the stratigraphic record, which is a record of major catastrophic events and not the slow year-by-year buildup suggested by uniformitarianism. Flysch deposits might be the sedimentary results of  a global  flood.  The idea of  geosynclines is  unpopular because most geologists believe in plate tectonics.   Emphasis Added

Extensive Strata and Pancake Layering:
As we observe sedimentary strata throughout the world  we see  almost  everywhere flat-lying (or "pancake")  layered strata.  Many of these layers are so extensive that they cover several states.  Evolutionists believe that such layers were deposited slowly over millions and  millions of years, or that they are simply "river" deposits  or river deltas.  42,43  Creationists, and a growing number of geologists see problems with such interpretations. 44,45  First because there is virtually no evidence of  erosion between the layers, and second, because the sheer size and extent of  the strata suggests that the layers were neither formed by rivers, or river deltas.  That's because many of the "layers" are quite thick, and cover (literally) hundreds and even thousands of square miles, and in many instances are the size of the state of Utah, or even larger.

This, coupled with the presence of marine fossils that are buried in many of the layers, tells us that they were deposited by ocean currents (i.e. from a major, major Flood), like nothing we have ever seen before.

We can say  for certain that it was the ocean (as opposed to a lake) because of the marine  fossils that are buried  in  much  of this strata.  For example, in the Grand Canyon area itself,  old Earth geologists  have said  that the Ocean swept over the whole area on six  different occasions.  Young Earth geologists say it  was probably only once.

A "Whale" of a Fossil:
Or should we say "a fossil of a whale? It's true, but what is most interesting about it is how it was buried. In 1976, workers from the Dicalite division of Grefco inc. found the remains of a baleen whale entombed vertically in a diatomaceous earth quarry. 

"They've found fossils there before; in fact the machinery operators have learned a good deal about them and carefully annotate any they find with the name of the collector, the date, and the exact place found. Each discovery is turned over to Lawrence G. Barnes at the Natural History Museum of Los Angeles County. The Whale, however, is one of the largest fossils ever collected  anywhere... (It) is standing on end.. and is being exposed gradually as the diatomite is mined. Only the head and a small part of the body are visible as yet.

"The modern baleen whale is 80 to 90 feet long and has a head of similar size, indicating that the fossil may be close to 80 feet long. 46,47

More Fossil Whales:

"In bogs covering glacial deposits in Michigan, skeletons of two whales were discovered ... How did they come to Michigan in the post-glacial epoch? Glaciers do not carry whales, and the ice sheet would not have brought them to the middle of a continent... Was there a sea in Michigan after the glacial epoch, only a few thousand years ago?"   48

"Bones of Whale have been found 440  feet above sea level, north of Lake Ontario; a skeleton of another whale was discovered in Vermont, more than 500 feet above sea level; and still another in the Montreal-Quebec area, about 600 feet above sea level..." 48

Marine Fossils In The Mountains:  
In Mountains all over the world one can find sea  shells and other marine fossils.  These include the Sierras,  the Swiss Alps, the  Himalayas and many more. 49,50,51,52,53   For more on this subject see the following  video 54 by Dr. Walter Brown.

Frozen Mammoths:   
Frozen mammoths and Mammoth bones are found in large  numbers in  Siberia, Alaska, and Northern Europe.  Some of these were in such good preservation that Eskimos would feed their dogs  meat from them when they became exposed due to melting  ice and snow: that  is, if wolves didn't get their first.  For those who want to know more see:  Frozen Mammoths

Fissures In The Rocks:  
In caves and fissures in  England  and Whales  and all over western  Europe are found bones and bone fragments of many types of extinct and extant animal species -- including the  mammoth, hippopotamus,  rhinoceros, horse, polar bear, bison, reindeer, wolf  and cave lion.  In virtually every case, the bones are disarticulated, without teeth marks, un-weathered, and in most cases broken and splintered. 55

"In the rock on the summit of Mont de Sautenay -- a flat-topped hill  near Chalonsur-Saone between Dijon  and Lyons -- there is a fissure filled with animal bones.  'Why should so many wolves, bears, horses, and oxen have ascended a  hill  isolated on  all sides?'  asked Albert Gaudry, professor at  the Jardin des  Plantes.   According to him, the  bones in this cleft are mostly  broken  and splintered  into innumerable... fragments and are 'evidently not those of animals devoured by beasts of  prey;  nor  have  they been broken by man.  Nevertheless,  the remains  of  wolf  were ... abundant, together  with those  of  cave lion, bear, rhinoceros, horse, ox, and  deer... Prestwich thought that the animal bones... were found in  common  heaps because,  '... [they] had  fled [there]  to  escape  the  rising waters.'"  55,56

Erratic Boulders: 
All  over Europe and  North America are found extremely large "boulders" which  were transported many miles by some mysterious force -- the most likely of  which  is a  massive flood  that swept over the Continents.  Concerning these Velikovsky writes :

"Some erratics are enormous.  The block  near Conway,  New Hampshire, is  90  by 40 by 38 feet and weighs  about  10,000 tons, the load of a large cargo ship.  Equally large is Mohegan Rock,  which towers over the town of Montville, in  Connecticut.  The great flat  erratic  in  Warren County, Ohio, weighs approximately 13,500 tons and  covers three quarters of  an acre;  the Ototoks erratic, thirty  miles south  of  Calgary, Alberta, consists  of  two pieces  of  quartzite 'derived from at least 50 miles to the west,'  [and weighs] over 18,000 tons." 57


Was the Flood Local or Worldwide? 
In the late 60's and early 70's:

"Two American  oceanographic  vessels pulled  from  the bottom of  the Gulf of  Mexico several long, slender cores of sediment.  Included in them were the shells of tiny one-celled planktonic organisms called foraminifera.  While living on the surface, these organisms lock into their shells a  chemical record of  the temperature and salinity of  the water.  When they  reproduce, the shells are discarded and drop to the  bottom.  A cross-section  of  that bottom ... carries a record  of climates  that  may go back more  than 100  million  years.  Every  inch of  core  may represent as  much as 1000  years of  the earth's  past." 58  Emphasis Added

"The  cores  were analyzed  in  two  separate  investigations,  by Cesare  Emiliani  of the University  of Miami, and James Kennett of the University of Rhode Island and  Nicholas Shackleton  of Cambridge University.  Both analyses indicated a dramatic  change in salinity, providing compelling evidence of a vast flood  of  fresh water  into the Gulf of  Mexico.  Using  radiocarbon, geochemist Jerry Stripp of  the  University  of Miami  dated  the  flood at  about 11,600  years  ago." 1  To Emiliani, all  the  questions and  arguments are  minor  beside  the  single fact that a vast  amount  of  fresh  melt  water  poured  into the Gulf  of  Mexico.   'We  know  this,'  he  says,  'because  the  oxygen  isotope ratios of  the  foraminifera shells  show a  marked  temporary decrease  in  the  salinity  of  the waters  of  the Gulf  of  Mexico.   It  clearly  shows that  there  was  a major  period  of  flooding  from 12,000  to 10,000  years ago... There  was no question that  there  was a  flood  and  there  is  no  question that  it  was  a  universal  flood. 58  Emphasis Added

"Emiliani's  findings are corroborated by geologists Kennett  and Shackleton,  who concluded  that there was a 'massive inpouring of  glacial melt water  into the Gulf  of Mexico via the Mississippi  River system.  At  the time of maximum  inpouring of  this water, surface salinities were... reduced by about ten percent." 58


The Black Sea Speaks:

"Science... has found evidence for  a massive deluge  that may ... have  inspired  Noah's tale.  About 7,500 years ago, a  flood  poured ten  cubic miles of  water a day -- 130 times more than  flows over Niagara Falls - from the Mediterranean Sea into the Black  Sea, abruptly  turning the formerly  freshwater lake into a  brackish inland sea." 59 Emphasis Added

"In  1993,  William Ryan  and  Walter Pitman  of  Columbia University's  Lamont-Doherty Earth  Observatory  dug up cores of sediment  from  the bottom of  the Black sea.  The cores showed  that  the sea's  outer margins had once been dry  land, indicating it had been two-thirds  its  present size.  Furthermore, over  the entire sea bottom was a thin, uniform layer  of sediment that  could only have been deposited  during  a  flood.  The researchers  also found that within that layer saltwater  mollusks appear, all  from the Mediterranean and all dating from around  7600 years ago." 59 Emphasis Added


Miracle or Worldwide Flood?

"Such a hypothesis would  require assumption of a  highly  unlikely pattern of  faunal migrations, where swarms of species of Manticoceras  are followed, everywhere at the  same distance and  the same time interval, by swarms of species of Cheiloceras,  the two waves  preserving their  separate identities on a staggered mass migration around the world ... without evolutionary changes and  without ever  becoming mixed..." 60 Emphasis Added

"It  would  be  easy to repeat this investigation for  almost every critical zone  fossil  or  fauna throughout the geological column  for  hundreds,  perhaps thousands of... cases.  The conclusions would be the same.  In the words of Jeletsky (1956) we  would have  to  'invoke a miracle', if,  for example, we were to assume  anything but world-wide  contemporaneous  deposition for  each of  the 55 ammonite  zones of the Jurassic.  Not  all  of  them occur everywhere, but wherever  two or more  are  found in  superposition  they occur  in the same order. 60 Arkell (1957,  p.  L112) 61  summarized  the picture of  ... Mesozoic ammonoids as follows:   Emphasis Added

'Evolution is above all  very uneven.  Certain periods were outstandingly productive  of  new and verile  forms  which  often  seem  to have sprung  into existence  from  nowhere ...  and  to have become dominant  almost simultaneously over a large part of  the world ...  

How such sudden multiple creations were brought about is  a task  for the  future  to determine.'" 60,61  Emphasis added                                                                                                    


Worldwide Chaos and Out of Order
Fossils:
The following excerpts provide further evidence that something is amiss with the Geological Time Chart and the associated Theory of Evolution itself.

"I regard the failure to find  a  clear  'vector  of progress' in  life's  history as  the most  puzzling  fact of the  fossil record."  62 

And that:
  
"Heretofore, we  have thrown up our hands in frustration at  the lack  of expected pattern in  life's  history --  or  we  have  sought to impose  a  pattern that  we hoped  to find on a  world that does not really display it...  If we can develop a...theory of mass extinction, we  may finally understand  why life has thwarted our expectations, and...extract an  unexpected ... pattern from apparent chaos." 62   Stephen Jay Gould      Emphasis added.

"One of  the ironies of  the evolution-creation debate is  that the creationists have accepted the mistaken notion that the  fossil record shows a  detailed  and orderly progression..." 63   David M. Raup   Emphasis added.

"only  15-20%  of the earth's land surface has even 3 geologic  periods appearing in 'correct'  consecutive order."  64  John Woodmorappe   Emphasis added       
                    
"Any sequence in which an  older  fossil occurs  above a  younger one is stratigraphically disordered ... disorder may  be  from  millimeters to  many meters  ... (and) is produced by  the physical or biogenic mixing of ... sediments ... Since  these processes occur to  an extent in  virtually all sedimentary systems, stratigraphic  disorder  at some scale is  probably  a  common  feature of  the  fossil  record." 65  Emphasis Added           

"The  extent of disorder ...is not well documented;  however, the widespread occurrence  of anomalies  ... suggest that disorder should  be taken  seriously..."  ref. 61  p. 234.  W. J. Arkell.   Emphasis added 

"Examination  of Britain's record of  the Ice Age levels  discloses  a  'complex  interbedding of drift sheets derived from  different sources.'  'When  we add the additional complications  imposed  by thin  drifts, scanty  interglacial  deposits, and  the  frequent  presence  in  fossil-bearing beds of  secondary [displaced]  fossils  derived from  the reworking of older horizons,  we get a  truly difficult overall problem ... All in  all, British glacial  stratigraphic research  has encountered  exceptional  difficulties,' writes  R. F. Flint, professor of geology  at Yale University. 66,67  Immanuel Velikovsky   Emphasis added
   

A Note about "Problematica": 
"Problematica"  is the "code word" Paleontologists use to describe out of order fossils, or those that are not easily placed, or that are "mixed" in with  one's they shouldn't be with.   

If  one  were to perform an internet search on this word he or  she  may be  surprised at  how many web pages there are on it: especially considering that the word isn't even in the Dictionary: at least not an English one.  
For more on this see: Sea-Sloths and Out of Order Fossils.   

For those seeking more information on this Worldwide Flood which almost  certainly did occur, or  how a Boat with Thousands of Animals onboard could possibly have survived Here is  a  link that may  answer  some of  your  questions.  If not, feel free to email the  author, or to take the  IQ test.   

Copyright, 2006, Randy S. Berg; No part of this paper may be reproduced, used, or sold for profit without 
the express written consent of the author. Copies may be distributed freely for educational purposes only.     

References 

Home 

Selected Links 
Flood Legends
 
Polystrate Fossils 
The La Brea Tar Pits 
More Flood Evidence 
Genesis and the Flood
 
The Florida Everglades
 
Evidence from Scripture I 
Evidence from Scripture II
 
Evidence  from  Cyclothems 
Questions  about  Noah's  Flood 
Sea Sloths and out of order Fossils 
Tectonic Wedge Resonance Theory



The Age of the Earth

Introduction: 
Short Version 
Long Version 

Part One: 
Radiometric Dating and the Age of the Earth 

Part Two: 
Continental Drift and the Age of the Earth
 

Part Three 
The Big Bang Theory is in Big Trouble
 

Part Five: 
Evidence for a Young Earth 




from:http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/noah-story.htm

The first question to ask is, "When did this happen?" The Bible provides the answer. The Bible contains a genealogy for Jesus that stretches all the way from Jesus to Adam. The Bible lists ages for all the people involved, and when they were born. Therefore, since we know when Jesus was born, it is easy to track back to the date of Noah's flood. The great deluge happened in 2348 BCE. That's a very recent event in human history -- only 4,350 or so years ago.

What this means is that the planet was wiped clean just 4,350 years ago, and then the ark came to rest on dry ground. Out of the ark came eight people (Noah, his wife, his three sons and their respective wives) along with pairs of animals representing every species that we see on earth today.

The Questions

Have you ever thought about that? Just 4,350 years ago, there were only eight people alive on planet earth. For any intelligent person, this raises quite a few questions, with this one being the most important:

  1. Where did all of the different races and cultures that we see today come from? From those eight people came the Chinese, the Africans, the Europeans, the Indians, the American Indians, the Aztecs, the Aborigines, the Vikings, the Eskimos, the Greeks, the Romans and so on. Apparently they all came from these eight people.

Starting from scratch in 2348 BCE, how could all of those races and cultures arise? It is, of course, impossible for a variety of reasons, but let's gloss over it for now.

As you continue thinking about it, the questions keep coming. For example, how did Noah build the boat? How could four men and four women find, harvest, season, transport, cut, shape, assemble and seal all of the trees needed for a ship 450 feet long and 75 feet wide? That is a huge ship. For comparison, the Mayflower (which brought the Pilgrims from England to America) was only about 95 feet long, 25 feet wide and displaced 180 tons. [ref] The Mayflower was a big boat able to hold over 100 people, but it was a pipsqueak compared to the ark.

Using the simplest multiplication, the ark would encompass about 14 Mayflowers, and would therefore weigh at least 5 million pounds. However, because the ark is so much larger, it would have to be far stronger than the Mayflower, making it far heavier. The very largest ships built at the height of the wooden shipbuilding era (the late 1800s) had a maximum keel length of about 250 feet, and the ark is nearly twice that big. This was an amazing vessel. And it was all built by four men and four women.

It is impossible to imagine that eight people could build a boat that big. It is also impossible to imagine a 450 foot long wooden vessel. But let's gloss over that.

Perhaps God helped? But if God were going to help, he would simply manifest a boat from thin air. There is no need for Noah to build it as described in the Bible.

What about the animals, and all of their food? There are about 1.75 million known species of plants and animals (mammals, birds, insects, etc.) crawling around on the planet today, so they must have all been on the ark. There may be more than 10 million species total -- scientists do not really know because we have come nowhere close to cataloging all of the species found on earth. [ref] We don't think about this because we are not biologists, but there are a lot more species on the planet today than most people realize. There are, for example, 20 differences species of vultures. Just vultures. There are 23 species of crocodilians. There are 40,000 species of spiders. And so on. And they all have highly specialized diets. Imagine 40,000 little spider cages, and imagine feeding all 40,000 pairs of spiders. Along with all 160,000 species of moths. And all 17,500 species of butterflies. [ref] And all 350,000 species of beetles. Etc.

Is the boat big enough to hold millions of species? No. And it is definitely not big enough to hold all of the food they need for hundreds of days. For example, one panda bear needs about 30 pounds of fresh bamboo every day -- not something readily available on a boat unless you have a large bamboo grove handy. Similarly, koala bears need fresh eucalyptus leaves. Walruses eat fish and lots of them. Lions eat antelope. Vultures eat carrion. One elephant eats something like 100 pounds of food per day. And so on.

All of that food also means a whole lot of manure and urine. Imagine mucking out a barn that holds millions of animals. Could eight people do it? Certainly not.

Then there is the commute. How did all of the animals found on the far corners of the planet today commute to the Middle East to board the ark? For example, how did pairs of kangaroos, koala bears, etc. commute thousands of miles (not to mention the treacherous ocean crossing) from Australia to the ark? How did walruses and polar bears and penguins make it? What about all of the specialized species in the South American rain forests? In South America, there are 130 species of legionary ants (forget all the other kinds of ants) that we know of. How did they get to Noah? Then they also had to commute back. And they all had to eat their highly specialized foods along the way.

Then there is the DNA. There is no evidence in the DNA record that every animal species on the planet came from a single breeding pair that started reproducing 4,350 years ago. The amount of inbreeding in every species (along with the human species) would be tremendous.

And what about the plants? All of them would be killed too by many months underwater. It would take awhile for things like eucalyptus trees and bamboo groves to grow back, assuming their seeds survived the floods.

The problem with the water

Let's assume that all of these problems can be glossed over. The big problem that remains is the water. The Bible states quite plainly that:

  1. "[The waters] rose greatly on the earth, and all the high mountains under the entire heavens were covered. The waters rose and covered the mountains to a depth of more than twenty feet."

No ambiguity here. And there is no reason for God to lie about it. Mt. Everest was 20 feet underwater.

The peak of Mount Everest rises about 29,000 feet above sea level -- nearly five and a half miles high. That means that the earth was covered, in its entirety, with water 5.5 miles deep. This creates several important problems:

  1. Where did all this water (approximately 10 times more water than there is on earth today) come from, and where did it all go?

  2. If you assume that God magically imported the water from somewhere and then took it away again, you still have a problem with the fish. If God imported 5.5 miles of fresh water, the fresh water would have killed all of the salt water fish species.

  3. Then there is the immense water pressure. Five miles of water creates more than 12,000 PSI of water pressure at sea level.

  4. Finally there's the problem with Egypt and other ancient cultures. The Great Pyramid, for example, was built between 2600 BCE and 2500 BCE. Noah's flood occurred 200 years after that. It is obvious that the Great Pyramid never was flooded underneath five miles of water.

  5. And so on...

To handle the fish, the ark would need immense fish tanks. If you have ever been to a big public aquarium, or Sea World, or even a pet store, you know that: a) there are a lot of different kinds of fish, and b) fish tanks need a lot of sophisticated filtration equipment. How, exactly, did Noah build all the tanks, and power all the filters? Not to mention how the fish got there -- did they walk onto the ark two by two? Or did they swim through the air?

Let's say you are willing to suspend all your disbelief around all these myriad problems with the story. Let's assume that the flood actually did happen. If you are willing to go that far into the realm of the imaginary, then you end up asking a different set of questions:

  1. Why would God be displeased with the way humans turned out, to the extent that he would need to exterminate every living plant and animal on the planet? If God is all-knowing, then he knew exactly what he was doing when he created Adam and Eve (see Understanding Original Sin). If God is perfect, he would have no choice but to create humans right the first time.

  2. Let's say that our perfect, all-knowing God made a mistake and was displeased with people for whatever reason, and he needed to exterminate them. That's impossible, but let's say it happened. Why not simply kill the people, and leave the rest of the plants and animals alone? God shows in the book of Exodus that it is incredibly easy for him to selectively kill humans instantly and in massive numbers. For example, God kills only the first born children of only the Egyptians in Exodus chapter 11. Why not kill off all the evil humans in exactly the same way, rather than wiping the entire planet clean?

  3. Let's say God decided that he wanted to wipe the planet clean, and that he wanted to use a worldwide flood for whatever reason. Then why did Noah need to build the boat? Why wouldn't God create a boat out of carbon nanotubes or transparent aluminum, with all the specialized compartments and tanks that the boat would need for all of the animals, fish and food? The nice side effect of these advanced materials is that Noah's Ark would still be here today for all to see with our own eyes.

Explaining the flood

A religious person, hearing about all of these myriad problems with the story of Noah in the Bible, might try to engage you in a conversation like this:

  1. Chris: There is no problem with the story of the flood in the Bible. The Bible was translated incorrectly. For example, in the Hebrew the word for world, 'erets', could also be translated as 'land' rather than 'world.' So you see, the Bible is actually correct. The flood only covered 'the land,' not the whole world. Norm: Why didn't an all-knowing God choose a word that is unambiguous?
    Chris: Well, in Hebrew there is not an unambiguous word to use.
    Normal person: Didn't God create all the languages of the earth at the Tower of Babel? Why didn't a perfect God create languages that are unambiguous and solve the problem of word choice in that way?
    Chris: It was not his will to do so.
    Norm: Then why didn't God inspire the translator and make sure that he got the translation right?
    Chris: That would violate the translator's free will.
    Norm: Then didn't God rather drastically violate the free will of the men who wrote the Bible?
    Chris: No. You see, the men who wrote the Bible were different because...
    Norm: Forget it. Let's just assume that you are right. When God chose the word "erets" in the Hebrew he meant the "whole land" rather than the "whole earth." That's fine. Mount Ararat, where the ark is said in the Bible to have come to rest, is over 16,000 feet tall -- nearly three miles. It, according to the Bible, was 20 feet under water. We all know that water spreads out -- it seeks its own level. So if you dump enough water on one country to cover Mount Ararat, then that means the whole world is covered with three miles of water, and we are right back where we started.
    Chris: No, that's not right. You see, God is all-powerful, and he is able to constrain the water to a single land. So only one small part of the earth was covered three miles deep.
    Norm: What, you are saying that God erected a gigantic wall around the Middle East -- he created the world's biggest above-ground swimming pool three miles deep?
    Chris: No, he did not actually have to build a wall...
    Norm: Why is there no evidence for a 3-mile deep flood in the middle east 4,350 years ago?
    Chris: You are wrong...

Admit it. You have heard conversations like this and they are utterly ridiculous. The Christian is making things up out of thin air. The Bible, allegedly, was written by the all-knowing, all-powerful creator of the universe. Why in the world can't such a being get a story straight in the Bible?

If an all-knowing and all-powerful God wrote the Bible, then why are we having to create so many excuses for what he wrote, and come up with so many incredibly convoluted explanations to cover the myriad problems in his stories? Why didn't God simply write the truth to begin with? Any conversation about Noah's ark quickly becomes ridiculous like this because the whole story is ridiculous from beginning to end. Noah's flood, quite simple, never happened.

The meaning of the story

Any intelligent person also sees something far more sinister in the Noah story. If you accept that God wrote the Bible, and if you accept that he put the story of Noah in the Bible for a reason, then let's focus on the central message in the story -- that God exterminated every living human being on the planet except for eight chosen people, and God exterminated all other living things except for the animal pairs on the boat. God's central message in the Noah story is total annihilation. Millions of men, women and children were massacred, along with billions of plants and animals.

Compare this behavior to Hitler. At the time of Hitler's reign, there were approximately 18 million Jewish people on the planet. Hitler killed six million of them -- roughly a third. What words do we use to describe Hitler? We use nouns like monster, demon and fiend, and we use adjectives like abominable, disgusting, repugnant, nauseating, detestable, horrible and revolting.

So why don't we apply those same nouns and adjectives to God? What God did is far worse than what Hitler did. Normal people therefore ask, "Why in the world would anyone worship a being far more horrible and monstrous than Hitler?" It makes absolutely no sense.

The real story

So let's admit it -- the story of Noah and the flood is not true. Choose whatever combination of impossibilities you like, from the food storage space on the ark, to the manure removal problem, to the commute that all the animals had to make, to the fish tank filters. An all-knowing, all-loving, prayer-answering God did not cover the earth in water 5.5 miles (or 3 miles) deep and exterminate everything. There was no ark. There was no death of every living plant and animal, followed by a resurgence from single breeding pairs of every species. 130 species of legionary ants did not swim over from South America and then swim back, nor did the kangaroos, nor did the polar bears. And so on. It did not happen. If you want to believe it that's fine, but we can safely write you off as a nut case.

What does this mean? It means that what we have here is a fanciful legend that is clearly untrue. When you look at Noah's flood, as it is described by the Bible, it is obvious that it did not happen. This is not a case where we need to bring in scientists and experts to disprove it based on little tiny details. This story is clearly and provably untrue to any intelligent person because it is absurd on the broadest, most obvious levels.

Continuing to use your common sense, what does this tell you about the Bible as a whole? Was the Bible written by a perfect and all-knowing being, or was it written by primitive goat herders? Given that the story of Noah is a fictional legend and nothing more, what it means is that the Bible -- the entire Bible -- is a collection of stories written by primitive men. God had nothing to do with it. Either God wrote the entire Bible, or he wrote none of it, because we have no way to know which parts God did and did not write.

More importantly, whether true of not, you realize that the Bible's central message about God is that God is a reprehensible monster far worse than Hitler. God ruthlessly murdered millions of men, women and children for no reason.

Christians willingly worship this monster.

What do you make of all of this? Here are two points of view for you to consider:

  1. 1.The Bible is the word of the Lord. Despite all of the evidence (genetic, geological, geographical, paleontological, forensic, archeological and historic) that Noah's flood and the ark never occurred, you still believe steadfastly that it did. You believe that God intentionally exterminated nearly every living thing on the planet. You openly worship this reprehensible monster.

  2. 2.The story of Noah is a fanciful legend. The Bible was written by men, not by God.

Which point of view makes more sense to you?